Is there unrest between Donald and Melania Trump? Body language expert Jess Ponce III certainly thinks so. In an exclusive interview with Nicki Swift, he delved into the subtleties of their interactions at Amalija Knavs’ funeral, noting that the couple’s behavior may confirm the longstanding rumors that their marriage is standing on increasingly shaky ground. While the former first couple initially showed a united front, the fact that they left the event separately may indicate marital discord.

“After the family exited the church, there was a significant moment when Donald and Melania stood side by side without their son. Their expressions were somber, fitting for the occasion, as they maintained a respectful distance from each other,” observed Ponce. “Although their poses weren’t particularly unusual, it was notable that when it was time to depart, they [rode] in separate cars.” Donald may have been there for his wife, but he wasn’t hanging around any longer than he had to.  

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